--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCo meeting -- Meeting rules at http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/Development/Schedule/MeetingGuidelines -- Init process
bpeppleFESCo meeting ping -- bpepple, dgilmore, dwmw2, jwb, notting, nirik, kick_, jds2001, j-rod
Hi everybody; who's around?
* jwb
* nirik is here.
notting is here
* bpepple waits another minute or so to see who else wanders in.
* nirik noticed a meeting last night using the bot fas command to answer whos in the meeting. Kinda cool.
dgilmore is ere
* Kick__ is here
bpepplealright, let's get started.
* skvidal snoops
--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCo-Meeting -- sponsor nomination -- Jose Matos (jamatos)
* dgilmore missed his nomination
bpeppleThere were several '+1' on the mailing list to his sponsor nomination, and no objections.
* dgilmore will abstain
dwmw2as will I
* jds2001 here sorry for the late notice
dwmw2do we have enough +1 to approve him?
otherwise I'll try to rustle up an opinion somehow
jds2001er, sorry for being late
bpepple+1 here to jamato's request.
nirik+1 from me
notting+1, sure
bpepplealright, I see five '+1', and a couple of abstains, so we've approved his sponsor nomination.
any other comments on his sponsor request? or should we move on?
ok, moving on then...
--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCO-Meeting -- Features -- https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/Fingerprint
bpepplehadess: ping.
bpeppleanyone have any questions for hadess about this feature?
jwbdidn't we already have something like this in the past?
Kick__will this be supported by system-config-authentication ?
jds2001which required manual pam config
* nirik wonders if it runs in !gnome
nottingKick__: a patch is mentioned there
hadesskick_: already is, did you read the feature page?
nirik: yes
jds2001nirik: i can use thinkfinger in anything that uses PAM, I'm assuming this is the same.
nottinghadess: hm, i suspect this won't work with pam_mount, but that's probably expected
* Kick__ search for system-config instead of authconfig
jds2001Kick__: there is no system-config-authentication :)
it's authconfig :)
hadessjds2001: except that it's good code that supports more than one type of fingerprint readers
jds2001hadess: oh, no doubt. I'd like it to be easier to use and all that too, without modifying my PAM config by hand
which it looks like you've got :)
nottinghadess: what exactly is the key format that the fingerprint distills to?
hadesskey format?
nottingimage? random stream of bytes that's 500k in length?
hadessdepends on the reader
hadessusually pbm with a custom header for scanners
binary blobs for most swipe type readers
fprintd also supports storage plugins, although nobody's written any yet
hadessso people could save the fingerprint data to databases, or ldap or whatever
nottinghadess: when you say 'Fingerprints can be used for authentication and gnome-screensaver' is there anything that needs done outside of pam config to enable support?
hadessnotting: pam config can be done using authconfig
notting: there's enrollment as well, where you save fingerprints to the disk
that's done in the control-center
jds2001right i think what notting is getting at is you mention gnome-screensaver
did you make any changes there?
tibbs|hHas anyone considered how this interacts with kerberos?
nirikalso, xscreensaver worked with the old thinkfinger, so I would hope the pam config here would work the same way there.
dgilmorehadess: what control centre does the enrollment
nottingtibbs|h: i'd assume it won't renew a ticket, if that's what you're asking?
hadessdgilmore: gnome's
dgilmorehadess: what about kde, XFCE and other desktops?
tibbs|hnotting: Or get a ticket for you at login.
dgilmorehadess: i have a fingerprint scanner but dont have gnome installed
hadessdgilmore: they're welcome to use the nicely documented D-Bus API
tibbs|hAs long as its presence doesn't break the usual behavior of "type password, get ticket".
hadessdgilmore: you can use the command-line fprintd-enroll tool
nottingtibbs|h: don't see how it could/would
dgilmorehadess: how will it play with thinkfinger?
jwbi believe it obsoletes thinkfinger
nirikor should it obsolete thinkfinger (which is orphaned)
nottinghadess: re: the enrollment dialog... why does it need to denote which finger? just so it can remind you which finger you used later?
hadessi won't make it obsolete thinkfinger, because the behaviour is different, and you needed to manually modify files to make thinkfinger work
notting: yeah
jwbnotting, theoretically you can store more than one fingerprint and require multiple swipes
in case someone cuts off your index finger or something
hadesswhat jwb said
jwbor you cut your finger (more likely)
bpepplejwb: worse case scenario. ;)
nottingjwb: or explicitly tell your laptop that you're giving it the middle finger
bpepple+1 to Fingerprint feature.
jwbyeah.  giving your laptop the middle finger sounds good
nirik+1 here
nottinghadess: next step - pam_webcam_face_recognition?
bpeppleok, I see eight '+1', and no objections, so we've approved the fingerprint feature.
hadessnotting: hehe, could be done, but i'm not touching pam if i can avoid it
bpeppleanyone have anything else to add, or should we move on to the next feature?
hadess: thanks for taking the time to answer our questions.
--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCO-Meeting -- Features -- https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/Python_2.6
bpeppleivazquez: ping.
ivazquezRight here.
hadessbpepple: np
jwb"omit packages that don't rebuild/work properly"
bpeppleok, we talked about this quite a bit last week, any other questions about python-2.6?
notting+1. too much of a hassle to revert now ;)
bpepple+1 here also.
jds2001+1, I'll be bugging you about scope later :)
ivazquezI realize that the feature page needs some rewriting.
jwbplease :)
aside from that +1
nottingobviously we can check what doesn't rebuild. any way other than 'run everything' to catch anything that might have broken?
ivazquezWe could try the 2to3 tool.
I don't know how effective that will be though.
dgilmore+1 make it work
bpeppleok, that's six '+1', and no objections so we've approved the python-2.6 feature.
anything else about python-2.6 folks want to discuss?
alright, moving on then...
thanks ivazquez for all your work on this.
--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCO-Meeting -- Features -- https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/DNSSEC
ivazquezSure thing.
bpeppleanyone know Adam Tkac's irc nick?
dwmw2atkac, I thought
notting... on A Different Network, atkac. dunno about here.
(it's also late where he is)
dwmw2come to think of it, I'm not sure I've ever seen him here
bpeppledwmw2: yeah, I don't think I've seen him on any of the fedora channels.
anyway, his feature pages look fairly complete, so we shouldn't have to many problems discussing them.
jwbi'd like him to remove "invulnerable" from the page
nirikI would suggest that the other dns servers in fedora should be pulled into doing this if they also support dnssec.
dgilmorejwb: yeah thats about the only thing i didint like.
nirikpdns, maradns, and how does this affect dnsmasq?
dwmw2jwb: it _is_ in quotes... I think it's fine like that
jwbi think it's too subtle
jwb"significantly more resistant"
dwmw2then you don't need the quotes :)
* nim-nim runs
bpepplenirik: you might add that to the discussion page so Adam can get back to us on that.
jwbonly the sith deal in absolutes
nirikbpepple: can do
* dwmw2 should work out how to do dnssec
bpepple+1 to DNSSEC feature. Looks reasonable, and like the contingency plan states we can disable by default if it doesn't pass QA.
nirik+1, and will add comments on my questions.
Kick__looks good, +1
dgilmore+1,  though id like "invulnerable" updated
bpepplealright, that's seven '+1', so we've approved the DNSSEC feature.
bpeppledgilmore: could you add that to the discussion page?
* j-rod tardy
jds2001something more like "protected against" would likely be better
other than that, I've got no issues with this.
yeah, his page on the wiki states 'IRC: usually not on public IRC but you can catch me on mail'
geez that was weird
dwmw2I don't want "invulnerable" updated. By pandering to the muppets who might misinterpret it, we are misleading them further into believing they have a place in this world and shouldn't just be taken out back and shot.
jds2001i was like totally lagged
bpeppledwmw2: ;)
nottingwoo, muppets!
bpepplealright, any have anything else to add about the DNSSEC feature?
ok, moving on.....
--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCO-Meeting -- Features -- https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/TightVNC
jwbdwmw2, except subtlety can be lost on non-native english speakers...
bpeppleAdam is also the feature owner on this one.
dwmw2jwb: quotes aren't really that subtle.
jwbsays the native english speaker
* jwb stops arguing :)
dwmw2...who is typically about as subtle as a rhinoceros horn up the backside
+1 to tightvnc. Why didn't we do this earlier?
nirikdwmw2: it was proposed for 10, but didn't get finished in time I think (the package)
jds2001i think it needed some improvements as noted on the feature page
rwmjoneseveryone's aware of gtk-vnc?
nirikdoes this affect any other vnc using stuff? vino? virt-manager? etc?
and vinagre which is a new vnc client built on top of it
jds2001yeah, anaconda is specifically mentioined.
dgilmorethis seems to be server side not client side
jds2001so it would likely affect all of our vnc consumers.
dgilmoreneed to make sure the existing clients work with the new server
jds2001i thought it was both, actually.
jwbthere is a tightvnc client
nirikit has a client as well
jwbthe package name is 'tightvnc'
server is 'tightvnc-server'
dgilmorethe client is just another client
i guess that we would need to make sure existing clients work with the new features
bpepple+1 TightVNC feature.
notting+1 to the feature in general. testing seems covered ok with the test plan in the feature
* Kick__ +1
nirikrwmjones: vinagre lacks some features, like 'via'...
+1 here.
rwmjonesnirik, sure I was just noting that those exist :-)
bpepplealright, I see five '+1', so we've approved TightVNC.
anyone have any other questions or comments?
bpepplealright, that was all the features we had for this week.
--- bpepple has changed the topic to: FESCo meeting -- Free discussion around Fedora
jds2001_sorry for the lag, +1 to tightvnc
bpeppleAnything else folks want to discuss this week?
tibbs|hI want to note that FPC met but I have not had time to write the summary.  Having one day less is tough.
nirikgeneral poll: who from fesco is going to be at fudcon? do we want to meet there and/or do a 'yell at fesco' session?
bpeppletibbs|h: yeah, that sucks, but not much we can do about that since Thursday didn't work for our new members.
nim-nimtibbs|h: can you have FESCO approve the fonts stuff now?
jwbnirik, still up in the air for me.  doubtful
tibbs|hnim-nim: That is not up to me.
dwmw2I almost certainly won't be
bpepplenim-nim: I don't think most of us have had a chance to even read the proposal.
nim-nimbpepple: ok :(
bpepplenirik: I don't think I'll be there either.
* jds2001 will be there
jds2001and we can have a yell at fesco session :)
jds2001even if it's just us two :)
* notting will be at fudcon
jds2001well notting will be there too
* nirik should be there.
j-rod will be there
Kick__too far from here ;-(
bpeppleAlright, anything else? Or should we wrap up for this week?
jwbi have something
bpepplejwb: floors yours.
jwbi bugged the various secondary arch teams
most of them came back with "meh. we're working on it"
seems the biggest hurdle is what dgilmore is already working on with the koji support
bpepplejwb: yeah, I saw the various summaries, I was going to summarize some of them in the FESCo meeting summary.
jwbafter that, it was mostly "time"
* dgilmore will be at fudcon
nirikI noticed that most of them said they were working on building f10 packages. Wouldn't it be better to work on getting rawhide building along with fedora rawhide?
ie, get on the train instead of building the one that already left the station?
dgilmorejwb: pretty much its blocking on me
jwbnirik, yes and no
dgilmorejwb: i keep up with all teh secondary arch teams regullary already
I guess i should report on that
jwbnirik, yes in the long run, but building for a secondary arch can be hard enough without trying to track a massively moving target
niriktrue, but if you don't you will forever be behind...
dgilmorenirik: with what im working on they will be building F-10 and rawhide
nirikdgilmore: that would be ideal.
jwbnirik, what dgilmore said
to do rawhide, you need proper koji support
* nirik nods
j-rodjwb: whats the official word out of the ia64 camp?
nottingthey would be the ones that have not responded yet
* dgilmore has been working on modifying the rawhide compose tools, and has it working for sparc every night
jwbj-rod, what notting said
jds2001, ?
jds2001_jwb: i just reconnected fro a second time in the same client
dgilmorej-rod: they have issues. one of which is that all the ia64 hardware died
j-rodthat's strangely poetic
notting*ALL* of it?
skvidaldgilmore: :)
jds2001died in what way?
was seized or is no longer functional?
skvidaljds2001: lost hope
dgilmorenotting: yes all of it
jwbfor some form of death
dgilmorejds2001: died in that you get nothing at the console when you power the boxes on
nottingdgilmore: oh, all == all the ia64 secondary arch team's. i was thinking more global
dgilmorethey had 4 boxes  one was DOA,  the rest have progressivly died
jds2001i thought it might have been something along the lines of "we need hte space, these ia64 boxen aren't doing anything"
dgilmorenotting: we could only hope
j-rodmy zx2000 still works... :)
bpepplejwb: anything else about secondary arches?
j-rodhas the ia64 squad asked for help?
can RH provide life support?
dgilmorej-rod: they are trying to find someone to take over management
bpeppleok, anyone have anything else to discuss? otherwise we can wrap up.
Rathannif I may, someone asked me about the status of https://fedorahosted.org/bodhi/ticket/79 which seems a pretty important feature
nottingbut machines whose serial console interfaces have died are not particularly useful in a colo
dwmw2Intel might be able to find some more hardware
nottingdwmw2: AIUI, they're on it
dgilmorenotting: kvm also gave nothing
bpeppleRathann: that's been a pretty outstanding issue, but no ones had time to implement it.
dwmw2let me know if it needs chasing
dgilmorenotting: the hardware should all be in westford right now
j-rodworst-case, I'm talking "I've got access to an altix and can build most of the F10 tree pretty quickly..."
nottingRathann: it's not as trivial as it seems
Rathannso it hasn't fallen under the table, good
dgilmorej-rod: :)
bpeppleok, if there's nothing else I'll start the ol'  countdown.
* bpepple will end the meeting in 60
bpepple will end the meeting in 30
bpepple will end the meeting in 15
bpepple-- MARK -- Meeting End
Thanks, everyone!

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